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 Post subject: Re: Net-whatever
 Post Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2014 3:55 pm 
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We have explored the idea of adding more logs and feedback about what the client sends to the server and what the server responds with. We are open to improving feedback for testing things of this nature and even adding some variables to play with different settings. From what I can tell in my short time being on the team, the issues with "netcode" and "hitreg" are the same issues any other shooter experiences in terms of who saw what when. Meaning, we aren't reinventing the wheel.

But as noted by ster!nn, we are always looking for ways to improve network communication and feedback to the user. Just last week I was having a conversation with several other devs about other types of network communication approaches and comparing that to what we were doing. So we sincerely mean that we hear the concerns and we watch the example videos and if we find improvements we can make we generally implement them.

Thank you for the post about BF4's idea on how to approach issues they are seeing. I will read up more about what they are doing.


Last edited by [Dev]Grubber on Tue Jun 03, 2014 4:00 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Net-whatever
 Post Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2014 3:57 pm 
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dgodfather wrote:
Side note - Are you suggesting that the netcode written for AAPG is superior to that of BF4?


I'm suggesting that AAPG netcode is superior to that of BF3. I'm suggesting that BF4 netcode is superior to nothing. Maybe on par with a game of battleship. A3? Miss.

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 Post subject: Re: Net-whatever
 Post Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2014 4:09 pm 
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[Dev]Grubber wrote:
We have explored the idea of adding more logs and feedback about what the client sends to the server and what the server responds with. We are open to improving feedback for testing things of this nature and even adding some variables to play with different settings. From what I can tell in my short time being on the team, the issues with "netcode" and "hitreg" are the same issues any other shooter experiences in terms of who saw what when.

But as noted above, we are always looking for ways to improve network communication and feedback to the user. Just last week I was having a conversation with several other devs about other types of network communication approaches and comparing that to what we were doing. So we sincerely mean that we hear the concerns and we watch the example videos and if we find improvements we can make we generally implement them.

Thank you for the post about BF4's idea on how to approach issues they are seeing. I will read up more about what they are doing.

I am guessing that you wanted to say "any other shooter with a network code similar to AAPG" and that's not a neccessarly a good thing, in fact is the opposite. With UE3 there are several ways for netcode implementation and for a FPS the current one is not the best.
"Lag Compensation" is the worst thing we can do to a FPS.


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 Post subject: Re: Net-whatever
 Post Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2014 4:24 pm 
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Grub, thanks for the repy.

When might we be able to see, or maybe hear more about the fruits of your labor as a result of the conversation the devs had?

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 Post subject: Re: Net-whatever
 Post Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2014 4:36 pm 
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Don Quixote wrote:
I am guessing that you wanted to say "any other shooter with a network code similar to AAPG" and that's not a neccessarly a good thing, in fact is the opposite. With UE3 there are several ways for netcode implementation and for a FPS the current one is not the best.
"Lag Compensation" is the worst thing we can do to a FPS.


On the contrary if I meant anything I meant other shooters I have played online which include Halo, Titanfall, COD, BF, PvZ: Garden Warfare. The issues that I see that we deal with are issues that can only be lessened, never solved. Lag is a plague of the internet and can only be helped by optimizing the crap out of what we are sending back and forth (hence statements of an ongoing process).

I am open to new thoughts though, UE3 is a huge engine so there is always something to learn. What way would you call the best for UE3 and an FPS? Feel free to diagram it out from Player A seeing Player B to Player A neutralizing Player B.


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 Post subject: Re: Net-whatever
 Post Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2014 4:39 pm 
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ster!nn wrote:
Grub, thanks for the repy.

When might we be able to see, or maybe hear more about the fruits of your labor as a result of the conversation the devs had?


This wasn't anything quite so formal. My point was that we think about it often. However, I plan to have a look at some potential optimizations post RFI-3.


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 Post subject: Re: Net-whatever
 Post Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2014 4:43 pm 
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I wouldn't say its a terrible idea. I'd guess it's implemented inefficiently.

Reading info:
http://community.callofduty.com/message/413601922

https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wik ... mpensation

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I'd say more times than I'd like, I'm really shooting at the polygons rather than the true player position. It goes both ways. Point being, for example: If I lean out around a corner, there is a good chance that a person on the other side of the viewing angle sees me well before I see them.

I think it goes to both ends of the spectrum. X compensation forward or X compensation backwards (or side to side if you want to look at it like that). I think the numbers need to be tighter. It's too loose and I don't get a good feeling about what I'm shooting at or being shot from.

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 Post subject: Re: Net-whatever
 Post Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2014 4:51 pm 
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dgodfather wrote:
I think it goes to both ends of the spectrum. X compensation forward or X compensation backwards (or side to side if you want to look at it like that). I think the numbers need to be tighter. It's too loose and I don't get a good feeling about what I'm shooting at or being shot from.


I look at it like limits in calculus. The idea is you want to get as close as you possibly can to having everyone seeing the same thing. Being a beta, optimizations can naturally be made and will be made.


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 Post subject: Re: Net-whatever
 Post Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2014 5:08 pm 
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[Dev]Grubber wrote:
ster!nn wrote:
Grub, thanks for the repy.

When might we be able to see, or maybe hear more about the fruits of your labor as a result of the conversation the devs had?


This wasn't anything quite so formal. My point was that we think about it often. However, I plan to have a look at some potential optimizations post RFI-3.


My point is that out of those who will support aa and help be the word of mouth for the Army, we've heard "We plan this Post RFI-X" before.

You can think, hope, talk, and plan one hand and in the other put "get-to-it-ness" in the form of fixing the audio engine/ adopting new, demorec, netcode, iron sights, map builds, optimizations...etc.

All the help anyone is willing to give is right here and the "doing it later" excuse just drives them away.

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 Post subject: Re: Net-whatever
 Post Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2014 5:17 pm 
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ster!nn wrote:
My point is that out of those who will support aa and help be the word of mouth for the Army, we've heard "We plan this Post RFI-X" before.

You can think, hope, talk, and plan one hand and in the other put "get-to-it-ness" in the form of fixing the audio engine/ adopting new, demorec, netcode, iron sights, map builds, optimizations...etc.

All the help anyone is willing to give is right here and the "doing it later" excuse just drives them away.


This is all I read...

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